How do you combat power creep?

[cronhound]

Myself and a few other people are coding a game similar to Kings of Chaos.

We've researched games similar to this and have come to realise that after a certain point, new players have absolutely no chance of catching up, which brings upon the chain reaction that inevitably kills the game.

> New players give up

> Old players no longer have a challenge, then they leave

The simple solution is to have rounds, as Kings of Chaos has done. But we want a continuous game, where it's balanced for all.

Which brings the question, how do you combat power creep?

[NonStopCoding]

i used to play this game called The Crims and they are round based game when you start out you have

5 Respect (goes up based on your stats and money)

$200 or something

and 10 of each stat (4 in total)

100% stamina bar

every time a user does a crime he gains money respect and stats

if you want to attack someone you need to find them in there rave or night club which is where you got to buy drugs to take to refill your stamina each drug has a certain % it fills your stamina.

The crims is a team game you cant win it being solo unless you meet other players but there is alot of backstabbers due to losing stats when attacking people same with gang attacks

Edited June 2, 2014 by NonStopCoding

[Script47]

• Make the game harder. So adjust the formulas/algorithms you use to make leveling/training etc harder.
  
• Put a cap on the attacking level. so you have to be in a certain level boundary to attack certain players. 1 => 5, 6 => 10, 10 => 18. You want to make it so that the other player doesn't get completely destroyed.
  
• Don't make OP weapons or armors. That just ruins the game. Even if they cost a ridiculous amount. If you're going to have those sort of weapons have them on DP (donator packs) or a way which anyone can them.
  

 

Those a few I thought off, I'll add more as I think of them.

[Zettieee]

How about set a cap to max stats. And use a Group Attack feature?

[cronhound]

i used to play this game called The Crims and they are round based game when you start out you have

5 Respect (goes up based on your stats and money)

$200 or something

and 10 of each stat (4 in total)

100% stamina bar

every time a user does a crime he gains money respect and stats

if you want to attack someone you need to find them in there rave or night club which is where you got to buy drugs to take to refill your stamina each drug has a certain % it fills your stamina.

The crims is a team game you cant win it being solo unless you meet other players but there is alot of backstabbers due to losing stats when attacking people same with gang attacks

I'm uncertain as to how this relates to the topic. :)

 

• Make the game harder. So adjust the formulas/algorithms you use to make leveling/training etc harder.
  

 

Making the game harder, would make it harder for newer players to catch up later on.

• Put a cap on the attacking level. so you have to be in a certain level boundary to attack certain players. 1 => 5, 6 => 10, 10 => 18. You want to make it so that the other player doesn't get completely destroyed.
  

 
I feel like this would make the game dull for players that reach a high level. Or, would leave the highest players untouchable.

• Don't make OP weapons or armors. That just ruins the game. Even if they cost a ridiculous amount. If you're going to have those sort of weapons have them on DP (donator packs) or a way which anyone can them.
  

 

OP weapons will not be a problem in our game. We also won't have micro-transactions that give money spenders an advantage, we are aiming for a game that is fair for everyone.

 

How about set a cap to max stats. And use a Group Attack feature?

A max stats cap would be disastrous in a game like the one we're coding. A group attack feature would also be pretty irrelevant.

___________________________________________________________________

Sorry to come across as rude, but I feel like the suggestions are aimed at a mafia game. If you have the time, I suggest you check out Kings of Chaos, it's a pretty addictive game when you're not majorly behind.

[KyleMassacre]

I'm uncertain as to how this relates to the topic. :)

 

Making the game harder, would make it harder for newer players to catch up later on.

 

I feel like this would make the game dull for players that reach a high level. Or, would leave the highest players untouchable.

 

OP weapons will not be a problem in our game. We also won't have micro-transactions that give money spenders an advantage, we are aiming for a game that is fair for everyone.

 

A max stats cap would be disastrous in a game like the one we're coding. A group attack feature would also be pretty irrelevant.

___________________________________________________________________

Sorry to come across as rude, but I feel like the suggestions are aimed at a mafia game. If you have the time, I suggest you check out Kings of Chaos, it's a pretty addictive game when you're not majorly behind.

I don't quite get it, you don't want players to be too far off of new players but yet don't want to cap their stats? Because I was thinking along the same lines here with a stat cap but on a level basis. Kind of like lvl 50-75 max stats would be like 1 million (numbers are just for arguments sake). This I think can make it fair for people that are in that group or lower because it gives them time to catch up/keep up.

or another idea that I had was to take a group of levels like above and do some sort of hall of fame for that group. This way it makes newer people or low level people feel like they are improving and the same would go for the more established players instead of having the "strongest" player in the game and going on from there. This way you are for lack of a better term "hiding" the fact that there is a strongest player. People would just see or notice the strongest in their league.

Another thing to do to go off what [MENTION=69670]Script47[/MENTION] was saying about attacking players is to make it so that high level players can't attack low level players but lower level players can attack whoever they desire as long as they don't attack someone for example 10 levels lower than themselves.

The only hard part is keeping the established players entertained but then again it is their fault that they sit there and play all day to get as high and strong as they can instead of playing the game the way it's meant, so it's always a good idea to have a storyline and just keep building off that. Possibly make it so they have to meet certain requirements to gain a level when they get so high for example:

 

• X number of missions completed
  
• Hold a certain ingame item
  
• Beat a certain NPC
  
• etc... you get the idea
  

 

This way you make them work for that level status and possibly up their stat cap

[cronhound]

I don't quite get it, you don't want players to be too far off of new players but yet don't want to cap their stats? Because I was thinking along the same lines here with a stat cap but on a level basis. Kind of like lvl 50-75 max stats would be like 1 million (numbers are just for arguments sake). This I think can make it fair for people that are in that group or lower because it gives them time to catch up/keep up.

or another idea that I had was to take a group of levels like above and do some sort of hall of fame for that group. This way it makes newer people or low level people feel like they are improving and the same would go for the more established players instead of having the "strongest" player in the game and going on from there. This way you are for lack of a better term "hiding" the fact that there is a strongest player. People would just see or notice the strongest in their league.

Another thing to do to go off what [MENTION=69670]Script47[/MENTION] was saying about attacking players is to make it so that high level players can't attack low level players but lower level players can attack whoever they desire as long as they don't attack someone for example 10 levels lower than themselves.

The only hard part is keeping the established players entertained but then again it is their fault that they sit there and play all day to get as high and strong as they can instead of playing the game the way it's meant, so it's always a good idea to have a storyline and just keep building off that. Possibly make it so they have to meet certain requirements to gain a level when they get so high for example:

 

• X number of missions completed
  
• Hold a certain ingame item
  
• Beat a certain NPC
  
• etc... you get the idea
  

 

This way you make them work for that level status and possibly up their stat cap

The suggestions would be great, if I were building a mafia game. But as I've said, I'm building a game like Kings of Chaos, here's why the suggestions in this thread would not work.

 

• There is no levelling system, users are ranked based on their average power for each statistic (Attack, Defence, Covert etc...).
  
• There is only a set list of weapons you can buy, they are available to all members and the costs scale nicely with the games inflation. Weapons require the right amount of units to use them.
  
• NPCs are not in the game.
  
• Missions are only used as a tutorial feature.
  
• Adding a level cap where users cannot retaliate against users with a lower level would be disastrous and cause a lot of issues
  

 

If you don't have a clue what I'm talking about, check out these similar games, where they've died because of the power creep our team is trying to combat (all of the games started at around the same amount of resources, look at the difference between the oldest and newest); Dune Wars (oldest), SGU Wars, Supreme Wars (in beta).

[KyleMassacre]

It sounds like you're trying to stop the inevitable with the continuous play game. Think of it like real life how do you stop the rich from getting richer? You really can't unless you're a communist dictator and tell them everything they are going to have or take everything away. People who play more will get more

[Zettieee]

^This guy is right!

If I play an mmo for 20 hours a day and someone who only plays for 1 hours a day has more gold/better items than me then I'm not going to play.

[Dayo]

I also started making a KoC style game the other day too, as me and a few mates at work started playing it then got banned for "Cheating".

What i plan to do is make starting the game fairly easy and then get progressively harder bvut as you level up you can unlock new items. Also i plan on having a monthly/3 monthly reset as this is the ONLY way to make the playing field even with these sort of games. There is no way you can let the game go on and on catering for new and old users as what every you do you will always piss someone off

[Script47]

I just came up with this idea now, but why not have different worlds? So like MCC's cities but instead of that as you progress to higher ranks (or whatever you have), you move up and you can't go back. That way in each world/city you have people who will be able to fight each other and not get obliterated completely. As you get in to higher world you get better items etc.

[cronhound]

I just came up with this idea now, but why not have different worlds? So like MCC's cities but instead of that as you progress to higher ranks (or whatever you have), you move up and you can't go back. That way in each world/city you have people who will be able to fight each other and not get obliterated completely. As you get in to higher world you get better items etc.

That's pretty similar to one of the ideas we've came up with, although we didn't have the idea of capping them by a statistic. It's something we'll definitely look into integrating.

[lucky3809]

Capping stats is a bad move, because players like that "achievement" to keep going, if you cap stats than all your players would end up with all the same stats, and it would defeat the purpose of your game, if it is an attacking game, and surely would end your game rather more quickly than it had begun.

Why not limit how much one can gain per stat, each time they have trained that particular stat?

Or use some type of a count bar for each of the stats such

Strength 10/1000

10= how many times they trained that stat with energy, and 1,000 is their goal to getting an estimated stat cap, such 50 strength when goal is reached, then a new goal proceeds after that one, of higher such 2,500 and so on...

Also you can not please newer players and make it easier for them to catch up, a game should never be like that, because also those players that have been playing a game for a long time also spends time and effort to get where they are in a game..

Edited June 5, 2014 by lucky3809